Sales Pitches
Like buying a car or a house, there are unethical breeders out there waiting to pounce on your money, with little regard for the puppy they are selling, or the impact it will have on your family and your wallet, in the years to come. They will say anything to get the sale - which is why it's important to get any promises or guarantees IN WRITING.
Before even reading below - rule number 1 - your breeder MUST hip and elbow score. No scoring, no sale. Hip and elbow dysplasia is THE most common health problem in the breed, and very expensive to treat, and sometimes its kinder to euthanise! Do not purchase a puppy from unscored parents, no matter what excuse is given to you. Look for hip and elbow scores in the advertisement, if it's not there, they are either not scoring, or unwilling to advertise the score as it may be high.
Don't be fooled by a snazzy website, or a cute little puppy.
Below are some examples of sales pitches we've seen over the years, and what they really mean!
- No Contracts.
Reading between the lines this means 'I don't care what you do with your dog as long as you are giving me lots of money!!' and/or 'my dogs are not of sufficient quality lines or type wise to generate sufficient interest if I did have a contract' ie: the breeder would not be able to sell puppies with contracts.
- Highly sought after
Why are you advertising - shouldn't you have a waiting list??
- Owner can pick main or limited register
You choose whether you want to pay me more for the same pup. The quality of the pup does not change with a piece of paper.
- All on main register
I want to get top dollar from this litter. Also can mean come back and i will let you use my stud dogs at a huge price.
- Breeding the best in Australia
Prove it! What major achievements have dogs THEY have bred attained? (not dogs they've bought from others - dogs THEY HAVE BRED). Ask the breeder to supply you with details of the major wins against a lot of competition, or at major shows. They should have wins at a group or show level, or best of breed against a lot of competition. Ask them how many champions they've bred? Where are their dogs strengths against the standard. 'Visually spectacular, imposing, superior, muscular, wrinkly' etc are all great words to throw around, and ALL breeders can say the same about their dogs, it doesn't make them any more special than ANY other Dogue de Bordeaux breeder. When they write they are 'breeding the best in Australia' - then ask yourself 'the best what?' - are there any specifics? They could be breeding the best lickers, or the best droolers, or the best toenails.... You'll probably find this line is used by breeders who just want to sell puppies.
- Several litters advertised
This isn't so much a 'sales pitch' but an indicator of a high volume breeder who is breeding for the pet market. Be advised that they are often poor quality (both in looks and in health). Yes, you will not have to wait for a puppy, they have them all the time! But these are often people who are not breeding for a hobby, but for an income. As with any business, to generate the most profit, you need to cut costs. This means poorer quality food, less health checks, and no recourse if things are wrong with your puppy. We have seen breeders advertising 2, 3, or even 4 litters at a time! Or breeders who have not even sold their last litter already advertising another on the way. By purchasing a puppy from these type of breeders, you are simply sentencing another dog to life in a kennel to be used as a breeding machine. Please be patient, choose a breeder carefully and WAIT. Too often people are impatient and that often ends in heartbreak by getting a puppy that suffers later in life - and so will your bank balance!
- Puppy page on their website has no specifics of litters, health results of parents, just that puppies are available, and uses plural terms like 'litters'.
You are looking at a page of a puppy farm. They are NOT breeding for a hobby or to better the breed, they are breeding as a source of income. Raising litters properly is a time consuming process. Socialization and one on one time is important. Volume breeders/puppy farms cannot possibly devote time to each and every puppy produced. The amount of litters/puppies bred by kennels is available from the governing body. High volume breeders will have puppies advertised ALL THE TIME, several litters at a time, and no specifics of parents are usually on their puppy page so they don't have to update it all the time with each littler/mating. Too much work for them.
- Options
Recently we have heard people are given options. Which pup they want on main register, if they want the heartworm injection, and a bunch of other things, all for an additional cost OF COURSE. Ethical breeders KNOW what's best for their pups. They will know when they should be vaccinated/wormed and with what. They will know what diet they should be on. They will pick the pups that are show/breeding potential and put those on main register. A breeder that gives you lots of 'options' is either breeding for money, uneducated on the breed, or both. Like a car salesman, they try and give you a heap of options, so they can make more money. Plain and simple.
- Upon vet check up.... will not have hip problems
Did the vet x-ray a litter of 7/8 week old pups?? Even low hip scored parents can throw a hip dysplasic dog, and you won't be able to tell/see that until they are much older and heavier. It is important to establish if the breeder is researching the hip and elbow scores in the lines they are using. You really need to establish whether the breeder can go back in their lines over a few generations, to be confident that there are dogs there that have low hip and elbow scores in the hope that it will carry on. If the breeder does not hip and elbow score - RUN AWAY, HANG UP, DELETE THE EMAIL - this is the very basic of health tests that MUST be done! (look for parents who score under 20, the lower the better, combined score of both parents should be under 30, 30 being the very most. Majority of breeders have a combined score well below this and as at the end of 2014, the breed average score was 17, so breeders should be aiming to bring this down even further. A low score is under 10. But again, ask for proof of scoring, some people LIE)
- Non refundable deposit
"I know that you will eventually realize my dogs are crap so I want to be sure I get some money from you or guilt you into completing the transaction because I probably won't be able to sell them otherwise." This is also against the Fair Trading Act in many states. Yes, breeders will ask for deposits to secure your puppy, but they should be refundable if your circumstances change and you cannot complete the transaction.
- Champion bloodlines
I'm yet to find a litter that doesn't have a champion in there somewhere. A ribbon means nothing if you purchase a pup who is sick, or develops problems.
- From imports/Imported bloodlines
Again, I'm yet to find a litter that hasn't got an import in it's pedigree - as far as I'm aware, Dogues are not native to Australia - and there are crap Dogues overseas as well - just because they were imported doesn't mean they are 'all that'. In fact, many unscrupulous breeders overseas will happily offload poor quality Dogues to people in Australia as there is little recourse due to distance and the cost of taking it further.
- Many kennels have our lines
We breed a lot each year, sell heaps on main registration to anyone wanting to breed.
- Please email rather than phone as we are very busy and unable to take calls (and/or there is no phone number listed)
So many people are ringing me with problems that I'm too scared to answer the phone.
- Parents both health tested
They took them to the vets to make sure they were healthy enough to breed from because they had not been sick and the vet said yes ...This often means they are not hip / elbow scored or otherwise though. Although this can also mean that the breeder has health tested, so you should ask for more information on what they have had done.
- Parents have the rare ability to mate naturally
I can just keep my dogs in the backyard together and leave them to it. This is NOT rare.
- Healthy puppies
Yes - they would be - problems are hardly ever apparent at 8 weeks old.
- Quality guaranteed
Didn't say whether they mean they guarantee show quality or pet quality, or what type of guarantee.
- Concrete guarantee
Once it leaves the concrete of my driveway its no longer guaranteed. Ensure your breeder has a written guarantee.
- It's the pick puppy I was keeping for myself but now not keeping any
It's the last puppy left and no one has chosen it yet.
- Won first place in his class
Was the only one in the class or beat one dog who was even worse.
- No 6 pt challenges/always beaten another dog/don't like showing due to politics
Whether a dog has or has not got 6 point challenges is irrelevant. If they have a lot - they may be in an area where there are never any other entries (or Dogues), that's not their fault. Or, they may have a lot of dogs they themselves enter, no use winning more points for being the best of a bad bunch! Ethical breeders will assess their dogs against the standard. If you are after a show or breeding dog - learn the standard - and assess their dogs against it. You will find dogs in the show ring, becoming champions, that should not be in the ring, let alone used for breeding, or people that do not show at all! It IS possible to register main registered puppies from a dog that itself has disqualifying faults, or serious faults, and also main register and sell pups that have obvious disqualifying or serious faults themselves. The governing body DOES NOT check this. With pets, it's not as important - but if you are going to pay a lot of money for a show/breeding dog, just because it's on main register doesn't mean it will be a great show and/or breeding dog!
- Exciting breeding/litter
What's exciting about it? It has likely been done about 300 x before.
- We're happy to help
...relieve you of a great deal of money and if you have a problem all our help will have evaporated. What have they put in writing to ensure your relationship continues for the life of your dog?
- True to type
Never shown my dogs or seen another dog in the flesh but fits 'type' in my limited imagination. Again - ask for them to elaborate.
- Reviving wonderful old lost bloodlines
In this country? Really? This is not the wild west in the 1800's with no phones or electricity!! The dogs weren't found marooned on some deserted island. Those lines weren't 'lost' - they were discarded... they weren't tried and tested - they were tried and disastrous but it sure sounds better describing it the other way!
- Not a 'spiel' as such but the most over-used word at this time - STUNNING
I'm just plain stunned at how often one can use the word stunning. Lets not even go down the road of actually determining just what is so stunning about some of these dogs/pups/lines.
- Free to range without restriction
Well that could mean 'I have no fences' but usually means 'I only have 2 dogs that run around the back yard together - and I'll ignore that those dogs may have been bred and reared in some hideous conditions.
- Dark mahogany
Might look like a hound dog and be crippled with health problems - BUT IT'S DARK. Colour should be the last thing you look for. A healthy good looking Dogue should be first.
- Rare breed
Nowadays it's rare to find a good example of the breed.
- Parents have suitable hip/elbow scores
We've kept it until now, so it's suitable. Hip and elbow scores should be disclosed to the buyer. They should be low to reduce the incidence and likelihood of hip and elbow dysplasia. There is NO reason why a breeder should not hip and elbow score. If you are not sure what's good - research more, and ask questions.
- Socialised
The most import time for socialisation is actually after your puppy comes home. See:
http://www.k9pro.com.au/pages.php?pageid=89
And even then - anyone who has watched any of the behavioral shows like Dog Whisperer or It's me or the Dog - or many other of the behavioral specialist videos will see you can condition a dog for anything no matter how old or what it's background is.
Just because a person doesn't have kids to expose pups to does not mean that the puppy will grow up to attack them, it's all up to you - the owner. And it's important that the kids it 'has' been exposed to are well mannered and interacting with them in a calm way. They may not mention the fact the kids have dropped them a couple of times as well.
- Pure bread
This one added just for a laugh. It is amazing how many 'breeders' advertise their dogs as 'pure bread'. Unless you are after something to toast, or eat for breakfast, you would be better off looking for 'Pure Bred'.
Before even reading below - rule number 1 - your breeder MUST hip and elbow score. No scoring, no sale. Hip and elbow dysplasia is THE most common health problem in the breed, and very expensive to treat, and sometimes its kinder to euthanise! Do not purchase a puppy from unscored parents, no matter what excuse is given to you. Look for hip and elbow scores in the advertisement, if it's not there, they are either not scoring, or unwilling to advertise the score as it may be high.
Don't be fooled by a snazzy website, or a cute little puppy.
Below are some examples of sales pitches we've seen over the years, and what they really mean!
- No Contracts.
Reading between the lines this means 'I don't care what you do with your dog as long as you are giving me lots of money!!' and/or 'my dogs are not of sufficient quality lines or type wise to generate sufficient interest if I did have a contract' ie: the breeder would not be able to sell puppies with contracts.
- Highly sought after
Why are you advertising - shouldn't you have a waiting list??
- Owner can pick main or limited register
You choose whether you want to pay me more for the same pup. The quality of the pup does not change with a piece of paper.
- All on main register
I want to get top dollar from this litter. Also can mean come back and i will let you use my stud dogs at a huge price.
- Breeding the best in Australia
Prove it! What major achievements have dogs THEY have bred attained? (not dogs they've bought from others - dogs THEY HAVE BRED). Ask the breeder to supply you with details of the major wins against a lot of competition, or at major shows. They should have wins at a group or show level, or best of breed against a lot of competition. Ask them how many champions they've bred? Where are their dogs strengths against the standard. 'Visually spectacular, imposing, superior, muscular, wrinkly' etc are all great words to throw around, and ALL breeders can say the same about their dogs, it doesn't make them any more special than ANY other Dogue de Bordeaux breeder. When they write they are 'breeding the best in Australia' - then ask yourself 'the best what?' - are there any specifics? They could be breeding the best lickers, or the best droolers, or the best toenails.... You'll probably find this line is used by breeders who just want to sell puppies.
- Several litters advertised
This isn't so much a 'sales pitch' but an indicator of a high volume breeder who is breeding for the pet market. Be advised that they are often poor quality (both in looks and in health). Yes, you will not have to wait for a puppy, they have them all the time! But these are often people who are not breeding for a hobby, but for an income. As with any business, to generate the most profit, you need to cut costs. This means poorer quality food, less health checks, and no recourse if things are wrong with your puppy. We have seen breeders advertising 2, 3, or even 4 litters at a time! Or breeders who have not even sold their last litter already advertising another on the way. By purchasing a puppy from these type of breeders, you are simply sentencing another dog to life in a kennel to be used as a breeding machine. Please be patient, choose a breeder carefully and WAIT. Too often people are impatient and that often ends in heartbreak by getting a puppy that suffers later in life - and so will your bank balance!
- Puppy page on their website has no specifics of litters, health results of parents, just that puppies are available, and uses plural terms like 'litters'.
You are looking at a page of a puppy farm. They are NOT breeding for a hobby or to better the breed, they are breeding as a source of income. Raising litters properly is a time consuming process. Socialization and one on one time is important. Volume breeders/puppy farms cannot possibly devote time to each and every puppy produced. The amount of litters/puppies bred by kennels is available from the governing body. High volume breeders will have puppies advertised ALL THE TIME, several litters at a time, and no specifics of parents are usually on their puppy page so they don't have to update it all the time with each littler/mating. Too much work for them.
- Options
Recently we have heard people are given options. Which pup they want on main register, if they want the heartworm injection, and a bunch of other things, all for an additional cost OF COURSE. Ethical breeders KNOW what's best for their pups. They will know when they should be vaccinated/wormed and with what. They will know what diet they should be on. They will pick the pups that are show/breeding potential and put those on main register. A breeder that gives you lots of 'options' is either breeding for money, uneducated on the breed, or both. Like a car salesman, they try and give you a heap of options, so they can make more money. Plain and simple.
- Upon vet check up.... will not have hip problems
Did the vet x-ray a litter of 7/8 week old pups?? Even low hip scored parents can throw a hip dysplasic dog, and you won't be able to tell/see that until they are much older and heavier. It is important to establish if the breeder is researching the hip and elbow scores in the lines they are using. You really need to establish whether the breeder can go back in their lines over a few generations, to be confident that there are dogs there that have low hip and elbow scores in the hope that it will carry on. If the breeder does not hip and elbow score - RUN AWAY, HANG UP, DELETE THE EMAIL - this is the very basic of health tests that MUST be done! (look for parents who score under 20, the lower the better, combined score of both parents should be under 30, 30 being the very most. Majority of breeders have a combined score well below this and as at the end of 2014, the breed average score was 17, so breeders should be aiming to bring this down even further. A low score is under 10. But again, ask for proof of scoring, some people LIE)
- Non refundable deposit
"I know that you will eventually realize my dogs are crap so I want to be sure I get some money from you or guilt you into completing the transaction because I probably won't be able to sell them otherwise." This is also against the Fair Trading Act in many states. Yes, breeders will ask for deposits to secure your puppy, but they should be refundable if your circumstances change and you cannot complete the transaction.
- Champion bloodlines
I'm yet to find a litter that doesn't have a champion in there somewhere. A ribbon means nothing if you purchase a pup who is sick, or develops problems.
- From imports/Imported bloodlines
Again, I'm yet to find a litter that hasn't got an import in it's pedigree - as far as I'm aware, Dogues are not native to Australia - and there are crap Dogues overseas as well - just because they were imported doesn't mean they are 'all that'. In fact, many unscrupulous breeders overseas will happily offload poor quality Dogues to people in Australia as there is little recourse due to distance and the cost of taking it further.
- Many kennels have our lines
We breed a lot each year, sell heaps on main registration to anyone wanting to breed.
- Please email rather than phone as we are very busy and unable to take calls (and/or there is no phone number listed)
So many people are ringing me with problems that I'm too scared to answer the phone.
- Parents both health tested
They took them to the vets to make sure they were healthy enough to breed from because they had not been sick and the vet said yes ...This often means they are not hip / elbow scored or otherwise though. Although this can also mean that the breeder has health tested, so you should ask for more information on what they have had done.
- Parents have the rare ability to mate naturally
I can just keep my dogs in the backyard together and leave them to it. This is NOT rare.
- Healthy puppies
Yes - they would be - problems are hardly ever apparent at 8 weeks old.
- Quality guaranteed
Didn't say whether they mean they guarantee show quality or pet quality, or what type of guarantee.
- Concrete guarantee
Once it leaves the concrete of my driveway its no longer guaranteed. Ensure your breeder has a written guarantee.
- It's the pick puppy I was keeping for myself but now not keeping any
It's the last puppy left and no one has chosen it yet.
- Won first place in his class
Was the only one in the class or beat one dog who was even worse.
- No 6 pt challenges/always beaten another dog/don't like showing due to politics
Whether a dog has or has not got 6 point challenges is irrelevant. If they have a lot - they may be in an area where there are never any other entries (or Dogues), that's not their fault. Or, they may have a lot of dogs they themselves enter, no use winning more points for being the best of a bad bunch! Ethical breeders will assess their dogs against the standard. If you are after a show or breeding dog - learn the standard - and assess their dogs against it. You will find dogs in the show ring, becoming champions, that should not be in the ring, let alone used for breeding, or people that do not show at all! It IS possible to register main registered puppies from a dog that itself has disqualifying faults, or serious faults, and also main register and sell pups that have obvious disqualifying or serious faults themselves. The governing body DOES NOT check this. With pets, it's not as important - but if you are going to pay a lot of money for a show/breeding dog, just because it's on main register doesn't mean it will be a great show and/or breeding dog!
- Exciting breeding/litter
What's exciting about it? It has likely been done about 300 x before.
- We're happy to help
...relieve you of a great deal of money and if you have a problem all our help will have evaporated. What have they put in writing to ensure your relationship continues for the life of your dog?
- True to type
Never shown my dogs or seen another dog in the flesh but fits 'type' in my limited imagination. Again - ask for them to elaborate.
- Reviving wonderful old lost bloodlines
In this country? Really? This is not the wild west in the 1800's with no phones or electricity!! The dogs weren't found marooned on some deserted island. Those lines weren't 'lost' - they were discarded... they weren't tried and tested - they were tried and disastrous but it sure sounds better describing it the other way!
- Not a 'spiel' as such but the most over-used word at this time - STUNNING
I'm just plain stunned at how often one can use the word stunning. Lets not even go down the road of actually determining just what is so stunning about some of these dogs/pups/lines.
- Free to range without restriction
Well that could mean 'I have no fences' but usually means 'I only have 2 dogs that run around the back yard together - and I'll ignore that those dogs may have been bred and reared in some hideous conditions.
- Dark mahogany
Might look like a hound dog and be crippled with health problems - BUT IT'S DARK. Colour should be the last thing you look for. A healthy good looking Dogue should be first.
- Rare breed
Nowadays it's rare to find a good example of the breed.
- Parents have suitable hip/elbow scores
We've kept it until now, so it's suitable. Hip and elbow scores should be disclosed to the buyer. They should be low to reduce the incidence and likelihood of hip and elbow dysplasia. There is NO reason why a breeder should not hip and elbow score. If you are not sure what's good - research more, and ask questions.
- Socialised
The most import time for socialisation is actually after your puppy comes home. See:
http://www.k9pro.com.au/pages.php?pageid=89
And even then - anyone who has watched any of the behavioral shows like Dog Whisperer or It's me or the Dog - or many other of the behavioral specialist videos will see you can condition a dog for anything no matter how old or what it's background is.
Just because a person doesn't have kids to expose pups to does not mean that the puppy will grow up to attack them, it's all up to you - the owner. And it's important that the kids it 'has' been exposed to are well mannered and interacting with them in a calm way. They may not mention the fact the kids have dropped them a couple of times as well.
- Pure bread
This one added just for a laugh. It is amazing how many 'breeders' advertise their dogs as 'pure bread'. Unless you are after something to toast, or eat for breakfast, you would be better off looking for 'Pure Bred'.